(1) AND if thou say aught touching the ascension of our Lord, for that was done bodily, and for a bodily bemeaning as well as for a ghostly, for both He ascended very God and very man: to this will I answer thee, that He had been dead, and was clad with undeadliness, and so shall we be at the Day of Doom. And then we shall be made so subtle in body and in soul together, that we shall be then as swiftly where us list bodily as we be now in our thought ghostly; whether it be up or down, on one side or on other, behind or before, all I hope shall then be alike good, as clerks say. But now thou mayest not come to heaven bodily, but ghostly. And yet it shall be so ghostly, that it shall not be on bodily manner; neither upwards nor downwards, nor on one side nor on other, behind nor before.

(43) Or dost thou suppose, that I write of the Fall of Man without Light and Understanding? Or that I do not look and see into the Holy Scripture, what that says of it, [when I say] that Man before his Fall was angelical in his Mind and Body? Then hear and see what Christ says of it, tin the Resurrection of the Dead, they will neither marry, nor be given in Marriage, but they are as the Angels of God. And such an Image God created in the Beginning, [according] to his Similitude.

(2) And look thou have no wonder of this: for mightest thou once see it as clearly, as thou mayest by grace come to for to grope it and feel it in this life, thou wouldest think as I say. But be thou sure that clear sight shall never man have here in this life: but the feeling may men have through grace when God vouchsafeth. And therefore lift up thy love to that cloud: rather, if I shall say thee sooth, let God draw thy love up to that cloud and strive thou through help of His grace to forget all other thing.

(77) Thou wilt say, How? God dwells in Heaven. O! thou blind Mind, full of Darkness; the Heaven where God dwells is also in thee, as Adam was both upon Earth, and also in Paradise at once; and give not Way to Antichrist to direct thee aloft without [the Place of] this World above the Stars, for he tells thee Prophet David says: If I fly to the Day-break, or into Hell, thou art there. Also where is the Place of my Rest? Am not I he that fills all Things? Yet I behold the miserable and those that are of a broken Spirit, and I will dwell in them: Also, / will dwell in Jacob, and my Tabernacle shall be in Israel: Understand it right, he will dwell in the contrite and broken Spirit, which breaks the Gate of Darkness, he will press into that [Spirit.]

(6) So that I lifted upward my bold face Crying to God, 'Henceforth I fear thee not,' As did the blackbird at the little sunshine. Peace I desired with God at the extreme Of my existence, and as yet would not My debt have been by penitence discharged, Had it not been that in remembrance held me Pier Pettignano in his holy prayers, Who out of charity was grieved for me. But who art thou, that into our conditions Questioning goest, and hast thine eyes unbound As I believe, and breathing dost discourse?" "Mine eyes," I said, "will yet be here ta'en from me, But for short space; for small is the offence Committed by their being turned with envy. Far greater is the fear, wherein suspended My soul is, of the torment underneath, For even now the load down there weighs on me." And she to me: "Who led thee, then, among us Up here, if to return below thou thinkest?" And I: "He who is with me, and speaks not;

(2) For if it so be, that they either read, or hear read or spoken, how that men should lift up their hearts unto God, as fast they stare in the stars as if they would be above the moon, and hearken when they shall hear any angel sing out of heaven. These men will sometime with the curiosity of their imagination pierce the planets, and make an hole in the firmament to look in thereat. These men will make a God as them list, and clothe Him full richly in clothes, and set Him in a throne far more curiously than ever was He depicted in this earth. These men will make angels in bodily likeness, and set them about each one with diverse minstrelsy, far more curious than ever was any seen or heard in this life. Some of these men the devil will deceive full wonderfully. For he will send a manner of dew, angels’ food they ween it be, as it were coming out of the air, and softly and sweetly falling in their mouths; and therefore they have it in custom to sit gaping as they would catch flies. Now truly all this is but deceit, seem it never so holy; for they have in this time full empty souls of any true devotion. Much vanity and falsehood is in their hearts, caused of their curious working. Insomuch, that ofttimes the devil feigneth quaint sounds in their ears, quaint lights and shining in their eyes, and wonderful smells in their noses: and all is but falsehood. And yet ween they not so, for them think that they have ensample of Saint Martin of this upward looking and working, that saw by revelation God clad in his mantle amongst His angels, and of Saint Stephen that saw our Lord stand in heaven, and of many other; and of Christ, that ascended bodily to heaven, seen of His disciples. And therefore they say that we should have our eyes up thither. I grant well that in our bodily observance we should lift up our eyes and our hands if we be stirred in spirit. But I say that the work of our spirit shall not be direct neither upwards nor downwards, nor on one side nor on other, nor forward nor backward, as it is of a bodily thing. For why, our work should be ghostly not bodily, nor on a bodily manner wrought.

(2) "What is that, Father sweet, from which I cannot So fully screen my sight that it avail me," Said I, "and seems towards us to be moving?" "Marvel thou not, if dazzle thee as yet The family of heaven," he answered me; "An angel 'tis, who comes to invite us upward. Soon will it be, that to behold these things Shall not be grievous, but delightful to thee As much as nature fashioned thee to feel." When we had reached the Angel benedight, With joyful voice he said: "Here enter in To stairway far less steep than are the others." We mounting were, already thence departed, And "Beati misericordes" was Behind us sung, "Rejoice, thou that o'ercomest!" My Master and myself, we two alone Were going upward, and I thought, in going, Some profit to acquire from words of his; And I to him directed me, thus asking: "What did the spirit of Romagna mean, Mentioning interdict and partnership?" Whence he to me: "Of his own greatest failing He knows the harm; and therefore wonder not If he reprove us, that we less may rue it.

(1) BUT now peradventure thou sayest, that how should it then be? For thee thinkest that thou hast very evidence that heaven is upwards; for Christ ascended the air bodily upwards, and sent the Holy Ghost as He promised coming from above bodily, seen of all His disciples; and this is our belief. And therefore thee thinkest since thou hast thus very evidence, why shalt thou not direct thy mind upward bodily in the time of thy prayer?

(2) And to this will I answer thee so feebly as I can, and say: since it so was, that Christ should ascend bodily and thereafter send the Holy Ghost bodily, then it was more seemly that it was upwards and from above than either downwards and from beneath, behind, or before, on one side or on other. But else than for this seemliness, Him needed never the more to have went upwards than downwards; I mean for nearness of the way. For heaven ghostly is as nigh down as up, and up as down: behind as before, before as behind, on one side as other. Insomuch, that whoso had a true desire for to be at heaven, then that same time he were in heaven ghostly. For the high and the next way thither is run by desires, and not by paces of feet. And therefore saith Saint Paul of himself and many other thus; although our bodies be presently here in earth, nevertheless yet our living is in heaven. He meant their love and their desire, the which is ghostly their life. And surely as verily is a soul there where it loveth, as in the body that Doeth by it and to the which it giveth life. And therefore if we will go to heaven ghostly, it needeth not to strain our spirit neither up nor down, nor on one side nor on other.

(40) Do not behold thyself, thou blind Mind, and consider thyself, where is thy angelical Form in thee? Why art thou so angry, stern, [fierce, froward,] and malicious? Wherefore dost thou elevate thyself still in thy Wickedness, in Pride, in Might [or Authority,] and Pomp, and boasteth thyself for a brave and potent Beast? What is it that thou dost? Wherefore hast thou High and Low. let the Spirit of this World into thee, which seduces thee (as it lists) into High-mindedness, into [proud] Stoutness, into P Potency and Pomp, into Covetousness and Lying, into Falshood and Treachery, as also into Sickness and Corruption, [or Frailty?]

(2) These are the questions which upon thy wish Are thrusting equally; and therefore first Will I treat that which hath the most of gall. He of the Seraphim most absorbed in God, Moses, and Samuel, and whichever John Thou mayst select, I say, and even Mary, Have not in any other heaven their seats, Than have those spirits that just appeared to thee, Nor of existence more or fewer years; But all make beautiful the primal circle, And have sweet life in different degrees, By feeling more or less the eternal breath. They showed themselves here, not because allotted This sphere has been to them, but to give sign Of the celestial which is least exalted. To speak thus is adapted to your mind, Since only through the sense it apprehendeth What then it worthy makes of intellect. On this account the Scripture condescends Unto your faculties, and feet and hands To God attributes, and means something else; And Holy Church under an aspect human Gabriel and Michael represent to you, And him who made Tobias whole again.

(4) For no such Earth or Flesh as we carry about us can subsist in the Light of God: Therefore also Christ said; None goes to Heaven, but the Son of Man who is come from Heaven, and who is in Heaven. Thus our Flesh before the Fall was heavenly, out of the heavenly Limbus. But when Disobedience came, in the Lust of this World, to generate itself in another Center, then it [the Flesh] became earthly; for by the Biting of the earthly Apple in the Garden of Eden, the earthly Dominion [or Kingdom] took its Beginning: And the Mother of the great World instantly took the little World into its Power [or Virtue,] and made it to be of a bestial P Kind, both in Form and in Substance.

(2) And he adds more clearly: "Him see I not, for round about, a cloud Has settled; for in mortal eyes are small, And mortal pupils - only flesh and bones grow there."

(8) If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things? And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

(5) And to the mortal world, when thou returnest, This carry back, that it may not presume Longer tow'rd such a goal to move its feet. The mind, that shineth here, on earth doth smoke; From this observe how can it do below That which it cannot though the heaven assume it?" Such limit did its words prescribe to me, The question I relinquished, and restricted Myself to ask it humbly who it was. "Between two shores of Italy rise cliffs, And not far distant from thy native place, So high, the thunders far below them sound, And form a ridge that Catria is called, 'Neath which is consecrate a hermitage Wont to be dedicate to worship only." Thus unto me the third speech recommenced, And then, continuing, it said: "Therein Unto God's service I became so steadfast, That feeding only on the juice of olives Lightly I passed away the heats and frosts, Contented in my thoughts contemplative. That cloister used to render to these heavens Abundantly, and now is empty grown, So that perforce it soon must be revealed.

(3) And what thereof, though our Lord when He ascended to heaven bodily took His way upwards into the clouds, seen of His mother and His disciples with their bodily eyes? Should we therefore in our ghostly work ever stare upwards with our bodily eyes, to look after Him if we may see Him sit bodily in heaven, or else stand, as Saint Stephen did? Nay, surely He shewed Him not unto Saint Stephen bodily in heaven, because that He would give us ensample that we should in our ghostly work look bodily up into heaven if we might see Him as Saint Stephen did, either standing, or sitting, or else lying. For howso His body is in heaven—standing, sitting, or lying—wots no man. And it needeth not more to be witted, but that His body is oned with the soul, without departing. The body and the soul, the which is the manhood, is oned with the Godhead without departing also. Of His sitting, His standing, His lying, needeth it not to wit; but that He is there as Him list, and hath Him in body as most seemly is unto Him for to be. For if He shew Him lying, or standing, or sitting, by revelation bodily to any creature in this life, it is done for some ghostly bemeaning: and not for no manner of bodily bearing that He hath in heaven. See by ensample. By standing is understood a readiness of helping. And therefore it is said commonly of one friend to another, when he is in bodily battle: “Bear thee well, fellow, and fight fast, and give not up the battle over lightly; for I shall stand by thee.” He meaneth not only bodily standing; for peradventure this battle is on horse and not on foot, and peradventure it is in going and not standing. But he meaneth when he saith that he shall stand by him, that he shall be ready to help him. For this reason it was that our Lord shewed Him bodily in heaven to Saint Stephen, when he was in his martyrdom: and not to give us ensample to look up to heaven. As He had said thus to Saint Stephen in person of all those that suffer persecution for His love: “Lo, Stephen! as verily as I open this bodily firmament, the which is called heaven, and let thee see My bodily standing, trust fast that as verily stand I beside thee ghostly by the might of My Godhead. And I am ready to help thee, and therefore stand thou stiffly in the faith and suffer boldly the fell buffets of those hard stones: for I shall crown thee in bliss for thy meed, and not only thee, but all those that suffer persecution for Me on any manner.” And thus mayest thou see that these bodily shewings were done by ghostly bemeanings.